From Rock Bottom to Redeemed: Lindsey Cooper’s Story of God’s Relentless Grace

In this episode of Hope Unlocked, host Kristin Kurtz welcomes Lindsey Cooper for a Holy Spirit-led conversation filled with honesty, grit, and God’s redeeming power. Lindsey shares how the Lord met her in the midst of addiction, identity struggles, and unexpected detours—turning every setback into a setup for redemption. Her powerful story is one of relentless grace, restored identity, and learning to trust God even when the path doesn’t make sense. If you've ever questioned your worth, taken a detour that felt too far gone, or wondered if God could still use you—this episode will breathe fresh hope into your spirit. Nothing is wasted in the hands of a redeeming God.

Lindsey's Contact Info:

Websites - Identity Dance and Identity Events & Entertainment

Instagram - @_misslindsey_  @identitydance_co  @identity_eande

🎙️Hope Unlocked Listener Exclusive! Feeling stirred but not sure what to do next? Book a 45-minute Holy Spirit-led 1:1 coaching session w/ Hope Unlocked host Kristin Kurtz, founder of New Wings Coaching. This powerful conversation will help you move from stirred to activated—with peace, clarity, & a Spirit-led next step. Book your call HERE now–special pricing to listeners!

Chapters

• 0:16 Introduction to Lindsay Cooper
• 4:15 Basketball to Dance: Following Her Heart
• 8:20 The Dark Detour: A Lost Season
• 16:05 Finding Dance Again: The Path Home
• 28:09 Midlife Awakening: The Soul Questions
• 34:54 Self-Love and Breaking Free
• 47:09 Encouraging Yourself When No One Will
• 59:54 Get Lost and Find Your Way Back
• 1:06:24 Closing Prayer and Final Thoughts

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:16

Welcome to the Hope Unlocked podcast. I'm your host, kristen Kurtz, and I'm also the founder of New Wings Coaching. I help and empower wildhearted and adventurous women of faith feeling caged and stuck, unlock their true purpose and potential, break free from limitations and thrive with confidence, courage and hope. If you're curious to learn more about coaching with me, head to newwingscoachingnet and be sure to explore the show notes for ways to connect with me further. Get ready to dive in as we uncover empowering keys and insights in this episode. So tune in and let's unlock hope together.

Speaker 2: 0:48

Welcome to the Hope Unlocked podcast. I'm Kristen Kurtz, your host. I pray this episode is like a holy IV of hope for your soul. Please help me welcome Lindsay Cooper to the show. I am so excited to have her here today. She is a mutual friend of Julie Nowaczki, I believe that's how we say her last name. So, Julie, if you hear this, please, yeah, give me confirmation on that. But I'm so excited to have her here today. We had a chance to connect a little bit through social media and messages and we talked a little bit before we got started here today and I cannot wait for her to share what's on her heart. But before we get started with that, Lindsay, could you share just a little bit about yourself?

Speaker 3: 1:29

Yes, so I am so excited to be here today. I am an Oregon, born and raised Oregonian. I own a dance studio called Identity Dance. Um, I also am a party planner, wedding coordinator.

Speaker 2: 1:49

I've been married uh 20 years and I have three kids, and they are 19, 14 and seven passionate like in the things that you shared, like what you're doing, right, mom party, wedding planner dance. Could you kind of back it up a?

Speaker 3: 2:14

little bit to share how you got into each of these areas. Yes, so when I was young, I discovered dance around age 13. At the time, I was a basketball player. I was actually on a traveling basketball team. I did year-round basketball. I was a short little point guard. My dad was my coach and, believe me, basketball was supposed to be my life from middle school invited me to a dance class with her and I fell in love in that first five minutes. And then I remember continuing that class and then going to my dad well, both my mom and dad right before I went into high school, and said, hey, I don't think I want to play basketball, I think I want to dance. And my dad said my dad said, like hell, you're not.

Speaker 3: 3:09

And my mom said, let's let her try. And I mean, basketball was supposed to be my trajectory, like I was going to be varsity, go to college with it. My older sister had played Pac-10 basketball, so I was just supposed to follow in her footsteps, college with it. My older sister had played Pac-10 basketball, so I was just supposed to follow in her footsteps, but I believe at that age I was really following that feeling in my heart that said, there is something about dance and music that makes me come alive. And so I just started to pursue dance and the year that I entered my high school they were coincidentally starting a dance team. So I got on that and we kind of went from there. And then by my junior year I decided that I wanted to make dance a career. But I wanted to dance professionally, like for an artist like Janet Jackson was my number one. But I was willing to settle for you know anything, anything secondary, um.

Speaker 3: 4:13

And by my senior year I had gone through a few things, you know, just like any teenage girl would. Um, you know, a few heartbreaks, some, some rejections, um, but I still decided that dance was going to be my plan for my life. So I got some scholarships to community college here and I majored in business or I'm sorry, I majored in dance, the minor in business but decided that school classes were not getting me to where I wanted to be. So I enrolled in dance classes from 9 am to 5 pm every day at LCC and I remember the day my parents got my transcript and they said, hey, we're not paying for you to go to school, just to dance. And I said, well, that's really crazy because that's all I want to do. So there was kind of a disconnect there. But I was one of those people who just kind of did what I wanted and I just continued to try to pursue that life of dance.

Speaker 3: 5:16

I tried out for Blazer Girls, which is, if people know Oregon, it's the Trailblazer dancers. I tried out for U of O Dance Team. I did a lot of different things there, but I remember getting rejected from U of O dance team in particular and I remember being so heartbroken about it. I decided to walk away from dance forever because I decided I just didn't have what it took to keep trying this, because there's a lot of politics in it and there's also a lot of rejection if you really put yourself out there. So I decided to just work and I dropped out of school, and through that, though, my heart was aching for things that made me come alive. So I decided to find that in partying. So I went a different road, took a little detour and decided to become an avid partier. Because there was people and there was music and there was typically dancing. I got a fake ID, I started going out to the bars. I definitely was seeking music and life and the things that made me come alive, and it definitely took me on a road that I'm not super proud of, but I do make a joke now that I'm actually a retired party girl now planning other people's parties. So I was getting life experience and job experience at the time. So I take that. I take that away from that season of my life.

Speaker 3: 6:56

And then, around age 21, I had definitely come to a place where I was feeling stuck. I had lost a couple jobs that I really cared about due to my lack of responsibility and really just not being able to juggle both lifestyles. So my roommate told me about a job that she had done. That was the traveling businessman, and I would be making a lot of money traveling all over the US, just as his personal assistant, and I said, great, hook me up, let me meet this guy. He took me out to lunch. He was very handsome, he was 15 years older than me and told me all this, basically sold me on the job, and said that I was going to have the time of my life.

Speaker 3: 7:56

And before leaving I said goodbye to my parents and I remember my dad saying keep your cell phone on. And he said or, this guy that I was going to be working for was with me at the time and he said, oh, she won't be needing that. And my dad kind of gave a little look and he's like she can always just use mine. And I didn't think anything of it. I was like, okay, maybe I'm not going to have time to be on the phone. I don't know, I was so naive. I just really did not pick up on that at all, neither did my parents. So went on this quote unquote adventure. Everybody thought I was, you know, leaving on this incredible thing. I thought I was leaving on an incredible thing and not far into it he took me out to dinner, got some drinks in me and we had sex. And the next day I called my roommate thinking I had made a big, really big mistake, and she goes oh no, that's actually just part of it. And I was like what?

Speaker 3: 9:01

and she's like yeah, just try not to think about it. I was like, why couldn't you have told me like what? And she's like yeah, just try not to think about it. I was like why couldn't you have told me Like what in the world? So I again, 21 years old, raised in a really strict Christian home, like my life was a mess back home. I had nothing to return to. So for me this was the best alternative and I decided to just try to take her advice. And but about four months into this, as you can imagine, I had lost every light that ever lit up in me.

Speaker 3: 9:38

He turned out to be a very angry, volatile person who had a drug problem. I was there to keep him happy in more ways than one, like not just the physical side. While he was running appointments, I was ironing his shirts and doing his dry cleaning and kind of being this like domestic, like housewife for him and his companion. That was very twisted. So I remember him telling me one day you know, when we get back home from this, this didn't happen and you don't talk about it. And I just said, okay, that's fine. And I thought in my mind, yeah, I'm never talking about this. This has been so weird.

Speaker 3: 10:24

And then I remember, you know, having been far from dance for at least a year. I was definitely not going to church for several months prior to this. Not that that matters, that just kind of paints you a picture of where I was at spiritually. But I remember sitting in the car one day on this trip with him.

Speaker 3: 10:47

I don't know what campus we were on, oh, he sold stationery for colleges like sororities and fraternities, so it was an actual job that he had, but my role was just a little weird. So I was in the car one day by myself, which I usually spent hours and hours, and hours by myself. I decided to pull out my journal and I started writing about all the things that we did, because he tried to keep the trip very normal. Like Empire State Building, like a vacation, like a vacation, like a vacation. Yeah, we, we went to dinner at the top of the John Hancock building in Chicago. Um, I mean, I was having quote unquote the time of my life. However, I was also experiencing hell on earth, but I didn't realize it because he had me so brainwashed to think that this was just kind of a normal thing, that people did so.

Speaker 3: 11:51

Anyway, I was writing about the things we were doing and then it shifted into a line that I believe was a prayer to God and I just said, hey, if you get me home safe, I'll dance again, and I really want to. And then I saw him coming, so I shut the journal and put it away. A couple of days later not sure about time because time is very skewed in a situation like that, but I think it was a couple of days later he handed me an envelope. I wasn't sure what it was. I opened it in front of him. I looked at it it was a plane ticket. My heart kind of sank because I just was really exhausted from all the travel and I was like, oh, where to now? And he said look. And I looked at it and it said Eugene, oregon, and it had my name on it. And he said you're going home. And immediately I wanted to ask did I do something wrong? Like why are you sending me home? But I didn't ask questions, I just packed my bags and had him take me to the airport and came home and realized my roommate had actually let somebody else live in my room for four and a half months and they had trashed the place and we're talking nonstop parties and cat poop on the carpet. And so I came home to wanting my bed so badly and just like it was just darkness, and so I went to my parents Didn't really explain why I was there, but I stayed there and I remember barely coming out of my room just to kind of go pee and eat food Once in a while. I remember that just being very dark.

Speaker 3: 13:41

Eventually I started working for my Dax. He needed an assistant and that was good I needed. I probably needed to be around him more than he realized. And then I remembered that I said I would dance again if I got home. So I found just a rinky dink dance class at the local gym, at 24-Hour Fitness at the time, and I walked in and the teacher immediately recognized me and was like Lindsay, oh my gosh, where have you been? You know that kind of thing. And I just wanted to hide in the back Like I in that moment just could not even look at myself in the mirror. I'd spent before that, I'd spent almost 10 years dancing and I just I couldn't even. I didn't even know how the class was going to go. I thought I was just going to be awful. I didn't want to look at myself and I kept going.

Speaker 3: 14:32

A couple of weeks in, and she came up to me and said hey, I'm actually needing to give this class up. Do you want? Do you want the class? Would you want to teach it? And everything in me screamed no. And the words that came out were yeah, sure, oh, I love it.

Speaker 3: 14:51

And so I just started teaching and I then, from there, got asked to teach at a local dance studio, with no resume, no experience. They basically asked me if I like kids and if I like dance, and I said sure, and then I did that. And then, all of a sudden, I got involved with a dance group and and and then I created my own. So within gosh, within four years of me saying yes to that class, that silly little hip hop workout class, I had a full blown studio with 200 students or more. Yeah, it was. It was a wild rollercoaster ride. And you know, and then you get. You know, you meet your husband, and then you start having kids and you're building businesses and you're doing everything right.

Speaker 3: 15:49

And then, years into that life, this life, I started realizing that I think I was exhausted. I think I was exhausted and I think that I was getting closer and closer to what they call like a soul death, and that sounds really heavy for what I told you all. Because in the midst of this I had decided to start speaking about what happened to me. I realized what happened to me actually at a church retreat with you know. I realized what happened to me. I realized what happened to me actually at a church retreat with you know. I realized what happened to me with that guy with that job at a church retreat, when I heard somebody else talking about what had happened to them and I was like, oh my goodness, that happened to me. And so I started picking and choosing who I would reveal it to and they started telling me you got to tell your story, you got, you got to get out there. You, you have to help people. So I did. Can I ask?

Speaker 2: 16:51

you a question really quick. Yes, please do. How long was it from the time you were doing this to the time that you had that revelation at the retreat?

Speaker 3: 17:37

So I was 21 when the actual trip was happening. It wasn't until I was 33.

Speaker 1: 17:45

32 years later.

Speaker 3: 17:47

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: 17:49

Wow, years later, you've got people telling you that you have to tell people your story.

Speaker 3: 17:54

It's so powerful and you're such a miracle and you know all the things that you should say to somebody who has an incredible testimony. I don't fault anybody for telling me to tell my story. I believed that I was going to start healing with telling my story and I did. It was very therapeutic, but then it caught on so quick. I was doing so many podcasts and interviews and speaking at churches and women's events and I did it like a and I was on the front page of like the newspaper here. They followed my family around for a week Like, oh my gosh, it was.

Speaker 2: 18:32

It became a little much so and every time it went from like being completely hidden in this To very exposed, completely exposed, yeah, and there was nothing wrong with it.

Speaker 3: 18:48

I actually really enjoyed the healing that I was feeling on some level. Also, I really wanted to be a good sounding board and also just a place a safe place for the young ladies. I was teaching board and also just a place a safe place for the young ladies I was teaching and this role model, this mentor I knew that there was going to be so much good in me speaking out. So there's really I have no regrets for that, but it does take its toll on you, and I believe that. And then COVID happened, and then I've only spoken at one thing. Besides today, I've only spoken at one thing since 2021. And so this is really cool for me to be here today, because a lot has happened in the last couple of years, a lot of surprising things that I wouldn't have even thought I was capable of. But there's just been some stuff and I'm excited to dive into it.

Speaker 2: 19:45

Yeah, what I I would love for you to share a little bit about. You know, just that experience of you know, just basically kind of getting to the point of getting wrung out where you discovered, like, what were you feeling when you were like I'm just kind of losing steam here. What did that look like? Because people might be experiencing that right now, not knowing, just continuing to keep going and going, which is not a bad thing.

Speaker 3: 20:11

We got to keep going.

Speaker 2: 20:12

But there's a moment that we have to actually pull back sometimes, right.

Speaker 3: 20:16

Well, and what I've learned too is people on the move sometimes are actually it's a trauma response, because if you can keep moving you don't have to feel, and if you can keep moving around, things that make you feel good like, for me, dance and music and all the things always just took my mind off of what I was really feeling, so you just keep going, right. But yeah, what I was beginning to feel was certain questions would pop through my head, like is this it? In an industry like mine, you can't always make everybody happy, but I try to build relationships with as many people as I can, and what's hard is when people leave or choose a different studio or or whatever. I started asking why? Why do people leave?

Speaker 3: 21:10

You know is it is it me. And then, one of the biggest questions that we're still wrestling with but that's why I'm here today is uh, am I still allowed to want more?

Speaker 3: 21:25

for myself because, ironically, my dance studio is named identity and there is so many to that word. I mean I try to preach a message of you are not what you do, you are who you are, first and foremost because I could break my back tomorrow and never be able to dance again. It doesn't mean that I'm not still Lindsay, and for the longest time, especially in the church circle, there was multiple Lindsays at our church and I was known as Lindsay the dancer and I took that on as an identity. And then you're a mom, so you're like Lindsay the mom or Lindsay the wife, or Lindsay the party planner, you know just all these things.

Speaker 2: 22:23

Yeah, the things you are literally doing so.

Speaker 3: 22:27

Then you want you start to question if I didn't do any of these things, like if all I did was show up in front of somebody and say I'm just me, I'm just sitting across from you as me, I have nothing to bring to this table.

Speaker 3: 22:44

Would they still want to be around me? And I think that actually women, especially in their forties because you know, I mean perimenopause is a huge thing to do with it but we won't go there right this second, you just really start feeling very deeply about a lot of things and then, at the same time, you start not caring about so many things, and it's a huge, it's a very oxymoronic place to be, because on one hand, you kind of want to burn it all down and then, at the same time, you are like, wait a minute, where did I go? Yes, these last several years, yes, and do I wake up in the morning actually excited about my life morning, actually excited about my life? Or do I wake up in the morning just needing to do what I need to do to A survive, B make sure everybody else is happy or is is not?

Speaker 2: 24:03

Yeah, so in those those that you mentioned, what was coming for you the most over these last few years?

Speaker 3: 24:11

Um, am I still allowed to want more?

Speaker 1: 24:15

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 24:17

And and why do people? Why do people leave? But I'm I believe that the more that I discover how to love myself, that's not as big of an issue now. But loving yourself is a very, very complicated and layered process as well. You just I don't think as women we're allowed to be like to vocalize that we might be really tired of trying to do it all.

Speaker 2: 24:49

Yeah, what did that look like for you?

Speaker 3: 24:55

Yeah, it's so wild. I realized this was happening. So wild I I realized this was happening. I think I first first realized it during during COVID, when we were not allowed to do anything and actually I was holding two different feelings. I was really sad about that, really upset about that, frustrated with that, but I was also really relieved and like I was given permission to rest and I didn't want it to end. But then I knew it needed to end because we needed to reopen our studio and reopen our business.

Speaker 3: 25:31

And you know you've got to make money, you have to work.

Speaker 3: 25:33

I mean, and I know it's my life work, so I'm not saying that I don't love it, I know it's my life work, but at the end of the day, my life work.

Speaker 3: 25:43

But at the end of the day I, at the heart of hearts, realized I think I was loving and serving people in order to feel better about myself and I wanted to figure out what it was like to love myself. And it looked really messy at the time. But healing is not linear and I love all the stuff that's circulating in the world right now and the generation that's coming up that really believes in healing and I realized that healing is 100% of the time. More often than not, maybe not 100% of the time, how about 99.9% of the time? The healing is way worse than the wound, and for me it definitely was. I was in this place in my life where I felt so empty and forgotten and very disconnected that I ended up reaching for something that made me feel alive at the time, and again what the ironic part of of that season was that it actually created like this hell on earth for me.

Speaker 2: 26:58

So you're it. It almost kind of takes me back to when, you know, when you, even as a younger, you know lindsey who had to reach. You're reaching for something else, right, yeah, um, because there was a I think you said it was a detour right, yes, yes, which we have these moments in our life that, um, the detours can almost be like a dead end, right, so we're looking for a lifeline or a, a road that's alive, but yet it ends with a dead end. But what, like? What has that been like for you over the past few years since, um, that moment, you know, happened, where you had this detour, um, because you had, you had that back when you're in your 20s and I think we have these wouldn't you go through these? Um?

Speaker 2: 27:53

yeah, I believe everybody everybody, it's all similar, yes, parallels, like we were talking before we started here. It's like, yes, with women we have different things that we go through and I think the hard part is that some will look at maybe what I go through or you go through or what other go through and and judge it.

Speaker 3: 28:16

Yeah, and they haven't been there. They haven't, yeah right, oh yeah. And I remember just having a real huge lack of resource and growing up and making friends within the church and believers and all these things, and in that incident or in that instance, I actually received more judgment than I did. Grace, and I own my mistakes, like I. You know, I look at, you know you look at all the things that you've ever done that are quote, unquote, wrong. Look at all the things that you've ever done that are quote, unquote, wrong. And I say quote unquote because I know that there's black and white, but I also know that there's gray and I also believe that God sees you in every choice that you make and there's really nothing that we can do to separate us from the love of god. Right, and but at that time I felt like this, is it, this thing that I've done? It's, it's gonna separate me yeah.

Speaker 3: 29:42

But I will say that not all detours are dead ends.

Speaker 2: 29:54

Mm-hmm yeah.

Speaker 1: 30:00

Yes, because the moment I got on with you.

Speaker 2: 30:04

I'm like this girl is so alive, you are so alive.

Speaker 3: 30:11

Well, that's good. Yeah, detours can actually be and wrong turns can actually be right on time, and it does not excuse choices. It doesn't excuse the hurt that it caused, but, man, there was purpose in it.

Speaker 1: 30:47

And.

Speaker 3: 30:47

I claim that now and I believe that it did awaken me because I realized I didn't love me and I was searching real hard for something to feel like that, like a life, and, yes, I believe in God's grace and I believe in therapy and I believe in whatever it is that gets you through the day, but at the time I really needed a lifeline and I didn't get it, but that's okay. Um, I have learned to have grace for myself, even when others withdraw theirs. Um, I also have learned, I think, the biggest lesson well, actually there's lots of big lessons. There's big doozies out of, out of this. Um, I am not defined by my worst day.

Speaker 3: 32:10

I am not defined by my worst choice. I am not defined by not one thing that I've done, hmm, and I don't have to clean up or get myself together or be better or be more just to make somebody else more comfortable with how my relationship with God looks.

Speaker 2: 32:45

Wow, my relationship with God looks. Wow, so did you. I'm just curious. Like these are like power words here, like I'm sure you've spoken over yourself. Yeah, like mass, like huge declarations, because I can only guess. I call things a flip the script because the enemy lies to us all the time, 100%. So what you just said might have been a flip the script of a lie that came for you. Is that right?

Speaker 3: 33:15

Yes, 100%. When I say I didn't think I was worthy of love, I meant it. In that season. There were times where I thought that, you know, maybe it like if people found out, or and again, this is going to be a little vague because I'm not quite ready to talk fully but, um, I do know, I do know that the flip, the script for me was yeah, this, this is not going to define me. I, I am worthy of the love that I was so desperately trying to find. Um, and god saw all, all of it, yeah, and he never wavered.

Speaker 2: 34:17

Yeah, he never left as you're talking and I'm, you know I'm just thinking of, like the prodigal son. You know there's so many like I think the. The thing about the Bible that I love so much is like he picked, like the imperfect people, disciples for the stories that are highlighted. You know it's not like they're all put together people.

Speaker 3: 34:43

No, I mean gosh, every single person. My favorite story is the woman who was caught in adultery and who just fell at his feet and people were wanting to stone her and Jesus just started writing in the sand. And the Bible never says what he wrote, and I love that because we don't need to know. Bible never says what he wrote and I love that because we don't need to know, because oftentimes we don't need to know what's going on between somebody and God and their process and the way that they're working it out, and on the outside it may look real messy, but what I've also discovered is that even people who say that they love the Lord and they want to minister to people, they're really afraid to get their hands dirty, and Jesus wasn't afraid to get his hands dirty. They're really afraid to get their hands dirty and Jesus wasn't afraid to get his hands dirty. So he got down on the ground and he started writing in the dirt and he looked at that woman and then looked at everybody else and said well, you, who is without sin, cast the first stone. So any of you basically what he's saying is any of you that have never sinned before can condemn this person.

Speaker 3: 35:44

And what I love about that is that, as alone as I felt, as abandoned as I felt, as in that moment of feeling like, wow, god, okay, so what was this whole life for again? Like serving you all these years and picking friends that loved you and all these things. Like, so that was. You're telling me that's a waste. Like now I need the grace that I've been extending to people for years and I can't get it. And then, not to mention the shame and the unforgiveness that I had for myself on the people that it hurt hurt the people that were closest to me. That it hurt you know. So, yeah, I mean I, I didn't need any extra shame, I already carried enough for myself.

Speaker 2: 36:35

Yeah, how would you? You know, I, I, I think sometimes in in me giving grace to other people. I don't always think that people, and even myself, I don't always know how to um come alongside people in their toughest moments. I mean, I, I'm similar to you, like I'm, I kind of taught myself like a first responder, like problem, like send me in Right, how, how would you like? Is there like a word that you would give somebody that you know, maybe they're walking alongside you know, best friend or or?

Speaker 2: 37:15

what happened and the best friend like just needs them in this time of, you know, crisis, like how would you like help them to help you?

Speaker 3: 37:28

Yes, I actually. I actually love this because I feel like I could talk about this, uh, a whole other podcast. Um, I have to have you back. Yeah, we could do that, um.

Speaker 3: 37:40

So what I believe that people need is for you to listen and not judge. And it has nothing to do with you. That's. The thing is that you've got to listen to people and realize it has nothing to do with you, nothing. Your relationship with God is not their relationship with God. Your experience is not their experience. What you would do in this situation is not what they are doing.

Speaker 3: 38:08

You're two different people, so listen to them, even if everything in you is like you know you did this to yourself or like every religious part of you inside is just like this is wrong, this is wrong, this is wrong. Okay, then let it be wrong. But if they don't go through their process like I had a process to go through If I would have just stuffed it down and said, oopsie, sorry, guys, made a mistake, I'll clean up now, like I'll be good, I would have been right back in the same place, which I did find myself very much circling back around the same temptation, and it's heart-wrenching because I felt like gosh, there is no rulebook for this. There's no rulebook. I have a process that I need to work out and I I need to work it out and I need to know that you're going to love me regardless.

Speaker 2: 39:11

Yeah, yeah, and have you? Have you found people in your corner now, like who, who listened to you through this process?

Speaker 3: 39:22

Yes, um, I actually had a couple of friends that came into my life at the time because it was kind of like a volcano that was erupting and so sometimes, when I would feel in front of somebody that I was safe, I would erupt the volcano on them, would erupt the volcano on them. This only happened twice, but they the both times. They said and both people were not believers, by the way and they said, wow, how have you been carrying this and what can I do to like just support you? And you know that this is actually like a symptom of a of a deeper like problem or issue. And at the time I thought, yeah, I'm the problem, I'm the issue, but really that's not what was being said.

Speaker 3: 40:13

It was it's unhealed unworthiness, it's a lack of self-love, there's just all these things. You don't feel like you're enough. You know, like you just spin your wheels and spin your wheels and spin your wheels, trying to be enough for everybody, and then you're just never enough for yourself. So, yeah, there are definitely some beautiful women that have, since, too, surrounded me. It's, yeah, it's been too surrounded me.

Speaker 2: 40:49

Um, it's, yeah, it's been. I love the question that you you pose like, and that they pose to you is like, how can I help you? Yeah, and, second of all, like the fact that they brought to light that this isn't just like a surface level thing. There's a root cause, kind of like we could do like in the medical as well, like when you're, you know, experiencing something. It's not always just the surface level thing.

Speaker 3: 41:12

There's actually a root cause behind things, right, always, and the fact that they brought that to light for you that's just a huge revelation and I would love to speak to somebody that might be going through something right now and just realizing that you know, maybe the people that they thought would be there for them weren't. Um, I wrote this in preparation for today. I just said some people come into your life and remind you of a part of yourself that you forgot. They don't stay forever, but they show you something sacred and sometimes that's enough.

Speaker 2: 41:48

Amen. Can you read that again?

Speaker 3: 41:51

Yes, some people come into your life and remind you of a part of yourself that you forgot. They don't stay forever, but they show you something sacred and sometimes that's enough.

Speaker 2: 42:05

Stay forever, but they show you something sacred, and sometimes that's enough. That's so powerful. You have a book in you, don't you?

Speaker 3: 42:18

I do. Actually, I've started it, but I keep stopping and I need to find like a prolonged period of time I can just go away and just get it all out. But my, you know, my biggest message that I stand on today is that we are all still becoming. There is no definitive like hey, once I get to this I should be have arrived, or you know, midlife awakenings, all these things we are all still becoming, and I've always gone through my life thinking I might be too much. And now I'm embracing that and I'm like, exactly, I went through a lot of my life thinking I was too much and being told, actually, that I was too much. And now I'm responding to that with exactly.

Speaker 2: 43:11

That's exactly period.

Speaker 3: 43:14

Yeah, exactly, period. There's no other words after that. And that's not a wall that goes up in me. That's literally like me owning saying if I'm too much for you, that's fine, Then that just shows me your capacity to handle what I bring to the table. Um, and my favorite quote in Alice in Wonderland is a mad hatter says to Alice you've lost your muchness. You used to be much, much here, and I just love that.

Speaker 3: 43:56

I think we need to stop hiding who we are just because we're afraid of how people will receive us are just because we're afraid of how people will receive us. I've actually discovered in the last couple of years that I love to crack jokes and make people laugh, and that's something that I just think that that's also in part of how my delivery will be Like when I write a book, when I speak, you know, and that's something that I think I used to be embarrassed about. Yeah, and it's, it's so wild, you know. And yeah, I just think that women ultimately feel like there's something wrong with them if they're coming like unraveled or if they're just questioning, or they're just having a hard time with where they're at or feeling stuck. I mean. There's like. The list can go on. But you know, I just would love to say to that person you're not broken, you're actually becoming, and you know, for me I realized there was.

Speaker 3: 45:00

Sometimes people would be like okay, we need to get back to who you were before. And I was like but that's not who I want to be anymore. That version of me was never the final one, always becoming. God is still writing my story, your story. We're not too late, we're not too far gone, we're not too tired. Well, we might be tired, but you know that's okay. Like the other day I put my, I put my eggs in the toaster oven and I put my toast in the microwave and I was like well, this is going to get me nowhere except for possibly setting the kitchen on fire. So we're going to chalk this up to the right now. I'm just tired, yeah.

Speaker 2: 45:52

Well, hopefully you haven't done where you were on the phone with your husband and where your phone was.

Speaker 3: 45:59

Oh, I've done that multiple times. Okay, we're not alone. Then, yeah, we're not alone. Then not just throw in the towel. They want to like not live anymore, because there's a very, very real and present darkness that will come in and tell you that what you've done is unhealable.

Speaker 2: 46:39

It's um, you can't get back to the way things?

Speaker 3: 46:51

were Um, you're too much and not enough. Everybody will be fine without you. It would, actually, they would be better without you, because I was there, and I was there just as recently as this last January, like January 2025.

Speaker 3: 47:06

So, you know this ebbs and flows. This comes in, it goes out, it comes back. But I think I have a better version of me to stand up to it. But what I would say is, when you feel like this because your thoughts will run rampant and you will be trying to grasp at anything that feels like something that's going to release these, these things that are thoughts that are coming what seems like from out of nowhere what you need to do is you need to breathe, is you need to breathe. And I won't say things like count backwards from 10 or go stand in the grass or look around you and see if you can name five things that you see. Those are all very, very good tactics for somebody who's having a panic attack or having anxiety attack. But when those thoughts come in, where, like it would be better if I wasn't alive, mm-hmm, I think you need to remind yourself that you've made it through your worst day and that means there's still more on the other side.

Speaker 2: 48:17

You're still becoming Lindsay, that is like breathing that in. Like would you say that over yourself?

Speaker 3: 48:24

Yeah, I had to multiple times. Wow, wow, multiple times, wow, wow. Yeah, I remember much to some people's dismay because I didn't really tell anybody where I was going. But I was having that kind of a day and I just started driving I heard a voice that I believe was God and it was just like just drive, just drive to the beach, drive to the coast, and it's like an hour drive from here.

Speaker 3: 48:50

So I did, and I ended up being the only person on the beach and it was January 25th and the sun was so gorgeous, it was just about to set and I was the only person there and I just sat there and I just watched it and I realized that I heard that was God telling me in the car to go. And then I realized that I could sit in silence and be okay with not some big epiphany or like some big release or just some huge emotional experience. You know, I think in spiritual circles, like you know, we're looking for like that big deliverance or that big emotional experience. But for me that day, I think that I just got quiet enough to hear my own voice and to calm myself down, and there's a verse in the Bible that said and David encouraged himself and I realized, man, he was king. He could have had anybody around him help him out and in that moment he was so broken he needed to find it somewhere deep down to encourage himself. And, ladies, you have it in you to encourage your damn self, yeah, if you need to say that again we have to

Speaker 3: 50:13

ladies, you have it in you to encourage your damn self.

Speaker 2: 50:16

Yeah, even if no one else will yeah, especially, um, you know, because you and I, before we got on here, we're both like in our dna. I would say we're both encouragers, right, yeah, yes. And like in our DNA, I would say we're both encouragers, right, yeah, yes. And several months ago I I took a few months off social media and I felt like I was having like encouragement, constipation, oh, wow, yeah, like not not giving it out, you know, yes.

Speaker 3: 50:48

Yes, I feel that way. The Lord actually said encourage yourself.

Speaker 2: 50:50

Yes, that's so good, good like I'm giving you to share with others. It's not, it's not always for everybody, it's for you. Yeah, yourself sometimes, oh yeah, so that is so powerful. And just think of, like, how much david walked through. Oh, I mean. I mean the psalms are like, yeah, my life sucks, but god, it's kind of like that's kind of the culmination. Mean, the psalms are like, yeah, my life sucks, but god, it's kind of like that's kind of the culmination of the psalms. It's like he's just pulled out, but then it wraps up with like he's encouraging himself, basically encouraging him. And I think I don't know if you would add this in too, but I remember when I was going through some really dark days several years ago, I had somebody say Kristen, get in the Psalms, read the Psalms. Yeah, have you done that?

Speaker 3: 51:41

Yes, I've actually read them multiple times over. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, you and I were talking before we started recording and we were talking about when you are given this. Like you know this purpose in life, like you know, you have this podcast ministry and I have a dance studio and you know even a party planning business that I also use as a way of connecting with people and encouraging people and celebrating people, and I believe that we growing up in spiritual circles are told you know, when you go through something hard, your breakthrough is just around the corner. So just keep going. Keep going. Your breakthrough is just around the corner and remember, your story is going to like impact people.

Speaker 3: 52:35

So, you know, do it for them, do it for the one you know we talked about this right, and for me, this last couple years has been Lindsay, get through this, break through this for yourself. Yeah, say that again. Yeah, break, break through this, get through this, start to heal from this for yourself, because self-love is not selfish. It is told to us that we cannot love our neighbor unless we love ourselves, and I'm not talking about become obsessed with yourself and narcissistic and only thinking about yourself. I'm not saying that.

Speaker 3: 53:22

I'm saying believe that you are worthy, believe that you are worthy of a love that is unconditional and that is grace upon grace, and that you can heal from all things, even if it doesn't look like how everybody else wants it to look or on a timeline that everybody else wants it to be on. That doesn't matter. Heal for you, because inevitably, when you heal for you it's it has a ripple effect. So you're going to heal for your bloodline. You're going to heal for the people that god has put around you your, your friends, all the things. You're going to impact people you never even met before. Right, but first and foremost, I'm sorry, but please be selfish and do it for you, because god doesn't make mistakes. Yeah, he created you on purpose. He created me on purpose. He actually knew all of this stuff was going to happen before it even happened yeah, isn't that incredible to think about?

Speaker 3: 54:31

it is, and I hate that there is so much calamity in the world. I hate that there is so much injustice. I hate that all the things that people are going through. But I think that when we focus on what can I do to be a better me, what can I then give to someone else to help them be a better them?

Speaker 2: 54:57

Yeah, can you? Can you say that I have you say things again, because I feel like you know the audience in the back. Yeah, right.

Speaker 3: 55:04

This is for the peanut gallery. Okay, I'm going to try to do that. You know I was talking about how I hate that there's just so much injustice and calamity in the world. But first and foremost, let's heal ourselves day by day and then, please be selfish, heal for yourself and then also, then you know, heal for someone else. Go give a part of yourself to somebody else that might need it and real one-on-one like.

Speaker 3: 55:37

I believe that the world may not change anytime soon, but we can change our world around us, like what's right in front of us, by taking time to just be with people and talk with people and listen to people when they need to be listened to, and play and like enjoy your life, because we really don't know when it's going to be over. We don't have a timeline for when our number is up. So enjoy even the really messy, healing, chaotic process, because it's not fun. I mean, gosh, what it feels like is not just like strings are unraveling, but like the whole damn rope is just coming unglued and you have no anchor and you're drowning in the middle of the ocean. I mean, that is an artist's depiction of what it, what it feels like sometimes and you're just, you're screaming help, but nobody can hear. You, can I?

Speaker 2: 56:42

ask a question. Yeah, I'm just thinking of something and I don't want to. I don't want to miss this. Yeah, so your passion is dance. And you know, I would obviously say like encouraging others and celebrating, which is actually tell people to celebrate before the celebration, Because I don't think enough people even celebrate themselves. Right, yeah, correct, but during this really challenging season were you able to dance?

Speaker 3: 57:13

freely? Uh, not freely, but I was. I had to show up.

Speaker 1: 57:19

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 57:20

I still had to show up, um, I was still dancing once in a while on my own by myself in my studio, um, but it looked very different than it would have, uh, you know a few years studio, um, but it looked very different than it would have, you know, a few years prior. Um, it was a little more, uh, rebellious and um, it was definitely not to worship music and um, just going to be real. Um, yeah, I mean, a lot about me has changed in the last couple of years because I think I've let my walls down to not have everything have to be so black and white that I believe that God is in just about everything. Uh, move of, of women that are, and, and men I, I'm not going to say just just women but that really struggle with who am I and why am I here. And if, if you don't heal from some of the things that not only have been done to you but that are unfair, but that you have owned and done in your life, then you know, then what's the point.

Speaker 3: 58:36

Like, I think that life is just full of, like I said, detours, and every single one. Oh, I have this interesting story from back when I was on that trip with that guy. So I mean so many hard things on that and I'm not going to discredit any of that. But there was one time where one of the expectations I had was or that he had of me was that every time we came to a new city he would give me the keys to the rental car and he would say go get lost. And he wouldn't say it like get lost, get out of here. He's like go get lost and find your way back.

Speaker 2: 59:17

And.

Speaker 3: 59:18

I was kind of a bad driver. I'm kind of still a bad driver, but actually I feel like I'm a really good driver. You have to get used to my driving style.

Speaker 3: 59:30

I actually think that I belong somewhere where people go much faster around here. But southern California, yeah, like maybe I should have been a race car driver, um. So I would literally go in like these sometimes really big cities and I would turn left and then right and then left and then go, and there was no phones like smartphones back then y'all Like there was there was no Google, there was no. I mean, we had MapQuest, but he told me I couldn't take a map. So and I would do it and I'm telling you I have like a crazy gift now for reversing things. Like anytime I'm anywhere, I can remember how we got there. And I'm not just saying that to like put myself up. I feel like it's a life lesson, like purposely. I actually believe that God gave me the season of my life and said get lost and then find your way back.

Speaker 2: 1:00:33

Wow, that's like a book right there.

Speaker 3: 1:00:35

And honestly, people might disagree with me on that, but I'm going to say no, I actually disagree. I believe that God handed me the keys to my life and said get lost and I'll be waiting for you when you get back.

Speaker 2: 1:00:49

Have you seen that quote? It's like all those who wander are not lost. Amen, yep, you like that? Like that resonates with me 100%.

Speaker 3: 1:00:58

And you know, again, speaking to somebody who might be walking or have a friend that's walking through something that looks like they're lost, there is a process for people who appear to be on a detour or lost. There are things they have to go through that aren't pretty yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:01:16

Yeah, wouldn't it be nice if it was pretty.

Speaker 3: 1:01:19

Oh, I would love that. So, like I saw this thing and this is going to be a little like maybe this is a little TMI, but I love stuff like this so it's like this meme that said, can't our period just be like 45 minutes, slough it off and be done with it already? Like that's what I feel like about life trials. I'm like, okay, I've got about 30 minutes where I could dedicate to get this in and out. Can we make an appointment and be in and out? Yeah, and I'm telling you this might be funny to some of you, but during that season where I was still having to like show up but nobody knew what was going on, and truly I mean I haven't like been completely forthright this time around. But, um, I mean gosh, there I was having to schedule my, my own breakdowns. Like I'm like, okay, tonight I think I'm going to have some time of myself where I could actually like like break down if I wanted to.

Speaker 2: 1:02:13

I mean that's so powerful though.

Speaker 3: 1:02:16

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:02:17

Like to be able to allow yourself that space, because I don't know about you, but if you've ever had things that you've grieved over, or maybe a loss in the family or something, else maybe, like me, you've just kind of compartmentalized it and then realized later down the road I didn't grieve that. And now it's coming up 25 years later.

Speaker 3: 1:02:42

Oh yeah, oh, grief is fascinating to me. I don't like it. I don't like it when people are grieving. I have a friend right now who just lost her husband. Um, he got sick and he was taken within a week. And I look at that and go how do you even, how do we even begin to start grieving? Because there's just so many questions Like but I told her, feel every single thing that comes to you right now and in the like forever, because if you don't, there won't be any, like I didn't say there won't be any chance of healing. It's just something like you've, you've just got to feel it all and you don't question it because the feelings are necessary and they're human. And I mean gosh, jesus wept he, I mean God freaking, created these emotions. And I mean gosh, jesus wept he. I mean God freaking, created these emotions Like I, I just believe in all of them you know, yes Are you a feeler too 100%.

Speaker 3: 1:03:40

I'm like this is part of my downfall. Actually, I'm an empath through and through.

Speaker 2: 1:03:45

Me too, I've had to learn how to harness it. And maybe on the next time when you come on, we can talk more about that. Yeah, you know.

Speaker 3: 1:03:53

I would love to cause. I've learned a lot being an empath and what that means for me versus what it means for other people. Um, and my expectations or how. How I need people to show up for me is not necessarily how I would show up for them, and it's a really hard place to be. Um, yeah, but yeah, this has been awesome. I believe that you know all those ladies out there that are might be going through you know what they would call midlife crisis. Turn that around and say midlife awakening Cause it is. It can be one of the most empowering things in the world.

Speaker 3: 1:04:28

I mean, we're all still becoming right, but now but now I, just you know, eat carbs without apology and I don't entertain nonsense unless it's my own nonsense.

Speaker 2: 1:04:41

You can look back on so many of these you know moments in our decades of life and be like, wow, I've come so far, right, so far so far. And to everybody who's listening, like, just look back. I sometimes have clients kind of dissect their life in like decades. Look back at like how much you've made it through, kind of like what you talked about, like you know, I've made it through. I've made it through, lindsay, as we close today, I, just as you know, I love to just imagine one person who's listening in today. Is there anything else that you'd want to speak over? Usually it's a woman. Yeah, and then would you pray us out today?

Speaker 3: 1:05:25

too. I would think my last thought would be I'm just looking over this, see if something jumps out at me. You know what's so funny is that when you said this is raw and unedited, I'm like, okay, well, I'm still going to have notes. I'm a planner. I think number one forgiveness starts with you. If you can't forgive yourself, then you know that's, that's a ripple effect. Once you start forgiving yourself, you can really do anything, and then you know grace for yourself as well, and you are not defined by your worst day. And I'll leave you with this. You are absolutely enough. In fact, you're more than enough. You need to get your much, much year back.

Speaker 2: 1:06:19

Love it.

Speaker 3: 1:06:21

Okay, let's pray out. God, we just thank you for this time. We thank you for every single person listening. We thank you for those that are grieving. We thank you for those that are in the middle of what looks like an unraveling mess. We thank you for those that have made choices that are quote-unquote wrong. We thank you for those that are listening right now that don't know which way to turn. I feel like they've gotten lost, but, god, I just ask that you would give them a picture of you just waiting for them to come home, and that maybe they're lost on purpose, because right now they're needing to take some lefts and some rights in order to get back to where you are.

Speaker 3: 1:07:06

We thank you, god, for every person listening that might be just struggling with their identity, with who they are, some that are struggling, quite possibly with the thought of giving up.

Speaker 3: 1:07:19

We just ask that, god, that you would just give them the strength to make it through today, and then enough strength to make it through tomorrow, one step at a time, one day at a time. We thank you for your love and your grace, even when we don't deserve it. We pray that that today, because of this story, because of what you've done in my life that quite possibly one person might make the decision to love themselves more and therefore be able to love others too. We thank you just for Kristen and her saying yes to what you're doing in her life. We thank you, god, for just protecting all of us. I pray, lord, that we can continue to look to you, look to you when we're not feeling like we're enough, and that, even if we don't feel you or hear you, that we know that you're there and we trust that you're there, and I pray these things in your name, amen.

Speaker 2: 1:08:37

Amen Lindsay, thank you so much for coming on. Definitely.

Speaker 3: 1:08:42

Oh yeah, I'm ready.

Speaker 2: 1:08:45

What would? Be the best to reach out to you.

Speaker 3: 1:08:48

Oh, so I, you know I have all the social media handles. I'm um at underscore, miss lindsey underscore, on instagram. I have uh, facebook, lindsey cooper, just search me up. Um identity dance company um the one in oregon, not anywhere else. Um, and then identity events and entertainment is my uh wedding coordinating and party planning business. Um, yes, please, please, uh, connect with me. Tell me if you listen today and you, you know, want to talk or need encouragement, cause I would love that. Um, I definitely went into today thinking, okay, I'm not going to talk about that and I'm not going to cry and I'm not going to do all these things, but you know, sometimes there's just other plans, so I would love to hear what you know the aftermath is on that.

Speaker 3: 1:09:46

Or if you just want a really like hype girl in your life to like pump you up, I can do that too, you're amazing.

Speaker 2: 1:09:53

I will be sure to add all of Lindsay's contact information in the show notes too, if you didn't catch it, so you can head to the show notes and find her info there. Thank you so much for being a brave voice.

Speaker 2: 1:10:04

Who's setting so many free and, as I say I'm going to close with the Hope Unlocked anchoring verse, which is may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope. And that's Romans 15 13. So thank you, lindsay, it's been a pleasure. You're so welcome. We'll see you guys next week.

Speaker 3: 1:10:26

Thank you bye.