When Grief Rewrites Your Faith: Finding Hope After Unexpected Loss with Francine Ivey

One phone call changed everything. Just hours after preaching a message called Consumed By The Call, Francine Ivey's husband unexpectedly passed away, leaving her to navigate unimaginable grief, questions of faith, and a completely different future. In this deeply honest conversation, Francine shares what sustained her in the darkest moments, how to truly care for someone who is grieving, and why our presence often matters more than our words. We also explore the power of Kingdom coaching, biblical discipleship, and how God can bring purpose from profound loss. If you've ever walked through grief or loved someone who has, this episode will leave you with hope.

Francine's contact info:

Website - www.consumedcoaching.com/become-a-coach 

Instagram

Francine's books:

Called to Activate 

Clarity is the Shortcut

21 Kingdom Success Principles

Calling Over Comfort

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Transcript

ReLight App And Quick Welcome

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Before we jump into today's episode, I want to tell you about Reelite. ReLight is a brand new web and mobile app, one without distractions of social scrolling and chat. If you're a content creator, coach, mentor, writer, author, teacher, or leader, Reelite gives you a dedicated space to capture what God is speaking, organize your content, and share it with those you lead. Ready to create and share God notes with your followers? As a special launch welcome, sign up is free through September 1st, 2026. Visit ReLight.com to get started today. That's spelled R-E-L-I-H-T no G. Welcome to the Hope Unlucked podcast. I'm Kristen Kurtz, your host. I pray this episode is like a holy Ivy of hope for your soul. Please help me welcome Francine Ivy to the show today. I'm so excited to have her here. We had a chance to connect, I think, just a couple times, and I was like, oh my gosh, I just love you. And would you be willing to share your story? Because I do believe that you're going to just share so much hope with our audience, and you've been through so much, and yet you're here, you're standing, and I know that you have a story to tell. So before we get into that, would you share a little bit about yourself? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:14

You know, my husband used to say we wear many labels, but the most important thing that he wanted, he was a he had four doctorates and all that, but never let anybody call him a doctor. He said, he said, but I'm a blood bot, born-again, spirit-led, spirit-filled, child of the most high God. And I guess if I was to describe myself, I have many titles, many things I've done, but that's the most important title of them all. So I'm a mom of four, three, not four, three. I claim a lot more, but I'm a mom of three. And we live in the Dallas-Fort Worth area. And yeah, we live calling over comfort is where we try to stay.

SPEAKER_00 1:52

That's a good word. So tell the audience maybe a little bit about what that means for you.

unknown 1:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:59

So I was married for 27 years. Um, and to the love of my

A Life In Ministry Together

SPEAKER_01 2:05

life, still get butterflies in my in my tummy when I think about his blue eyes and him holding my hand. And married him at 21, and we jumped right into ministry and everything from youth pastor to senior pastor to evangelism for a while as we traveled with young children. And I I told him I'd live in a ditch to do ministry with you. And um, so we we I really lived a life with my best friend, woke up with my best friend every morning and doing some of the most fantastical things with God. And uh not that there weren't hard things, but for the most part, I couldn't believe that, you know, not only would God save me, but he would use me this way and give me such an incredible family. So, and it was it was like that on January of 2017. We had a growing church. It was a brand new church start. Um, after we had a growing business at the time, just everything was going well. The kids were growing up, loving the Lord. That Sunday morning, my husband preached this incredible message called Consumed by the Call, and really calling everybody he'd ever laid hands on into ministry to live consumed by the call, not to be distracted by the things of this world, but to lay down our life. Much like, I mean, he preached on Elliot, Elizabeth Elliot, Jim Elliott, uh, yeah, with that statement, you know, that he is no fool if he would choose to give the thing he cannot keep to keep to gain the thing he can never lose. And we even sang that song that morning. Well, that afternoon we had chicken. My husband looked across the table from uh from me and said, I couldn't, he said, This is the day of the ivies. And I was like, the day of the ivies. I said, What do you mean by that? He said, I couldn't be happier with where our family is right now. Little would I know I would need those words extremely uh in just a few hours.

The Night Everything Changed

SPEAKER_01 4:05

He ran to the store. And because of a truck driver running too fast through a light lighted intersection, he took, he went home to be with the Lord that night. I pulled up to the accident, and you know, when the police told me, my friends literally had to grab me. My whole life just changed in a matter of an instant. And honestly, my my 16-year-old daughter probably said it best. She said, Mom, my whole life, she was 16 at the time, she said, My whole life, every statement that I believed about God had exclamation points in front of it. I mean, at the end of it. And she said, But right now, mom, they all have question marks, and I'm trying my hardest to pull them back into exclamation points. And so, I mean, that's where we were. Like what I think it's the same question most people do when tragedy hits. Why do bad things happen to good people?

SPEAKER_00 4:58

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think of I'm actually reading through Job again right now, and you know, all the questions when when we go through just really challenging things, the trials, the tribulations, I imagine that was probably one of the most I I don't even I've not walked through it before, so I don't know, but it just insurmountable grief. Like, how do you how do you even get through that first day?

SPEAKER_01 5:30

You don't even really get through it, you walk through it. I mean, it's just like it's it happens to you that first day instead of you doing your day, right? So, you know, for years I'd sat with other people who had lost loved ones. I was a pastor's wife, right?

SPEAKER_02 5:46

Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:47

I'd been on the other side of the table so many times, and so I assumed that all of my faith and all of my knowledge and everything that I experienced up until that moment would be would sustain me. And it did, but at the same time, I felt everything, right? There was that one doesn't negate the other, they just live in this very holy tension, right? True pain with comfort, true anxiousness for the future with you know doubt with faith, right? It it's all held in tension in that moment.

SPEAKER_00 6:22

That's really good. I I've not like thought about that before, like just even kind of the you know, the fear and the peace kind of kind of inner melding in those moments where um, because he is our peace, but yet we're in this human body with emotions. And I mean, I'm I'm feeling right now like I'm going, I'm imagining like that day for you. And as a mama, at that time you had three children. How how old were all of the children?

SPEAKER_01 6:52

21, 16, and an 11-year-old boy.

SPEAKER_00 6:55

Okay. So you have a an 11-year-old that, you know, still not even puberty time. Like how did you talk to him about everything?

SPEAKER_01 7:06

No, it was it, it was interesting. I think this was some of the lessons that I learned. All of us were grieving differently. You know, my 11-year-old son being also the only boy in the household at that at that time, was grieving one way. My middle daughter being 16, you know, daddies are so important to that 16-year-old little girl. And, you know, she rode with him everywhere, did ministry with him and everything. So she was unpacking differently. And my oldest, who was 21, also being firstborn, you know, dealing with her grief by taking on everything, right? And I think a lot of people ask me, what do I do if a friend is in that spot? I, you know, we've got four people grieving in a house differently, um, but all feeling very deeply. And a mom who, although wants to be the mom to three grieving kids at the same time grieving, you know, deeply as well, just being there, just, you know, letting letting people talk when they need to talk, because there's times when the family can't talk to each other because one person's grief sets off another person's grief too. So I tell people, just be, don't, don't feel like you have to say anything. Let them let them be with you and you be there to do whatever.

SPEAKER_00 8:20

Yeah. That's good. I guess, you know, maybe this is kind of where we're going today. Like, I I feel like there's, you know, I think a lot of times we want to try to talk, you know, like Job's friends, you know, it's like, how do we, how do we help? How do we try to help? The knowledge, like, how do we do this thing? Because we do want to be a comfort. Like, would you how would you say tangibly helping somebody? Would you? I think I I remember having somebody mention to me before, don't say how can I help you? It's more just offering like meals or maybe taking the kids to go do something. Like, what would you say in your situation looking back now?

SPEAKER_01 9:01

As far as meals, don't offer the meals, just bring them.

SPEAKER_00 9:04

Okay.

What Grief Feels Like In Real Life

SPEAKER_01 9:05

The especially for the widow, she's making a lot of decisions in a very short amount of time. She's in a lot of decision fatigue. And so, yes, and offering to take the kids somewhere, you know, and don't try to, yeah, don't, don't, don't try to avoid things. Don't be afraid of their grief. I think a lot of people were afraid of the grief, like, and and it comes out in, well, I don't want to make them cry, but crying is a part of their world right then. And it's okay, you don't have to feel guilty if you say something and they cry, they want to cry, they want to laugh, they want to talk about the loved one, and then they don't want to talk about the loved one. Let's just let them dictate that and just be in that, be in that swirl with them a little bit. Um, it just makes them not feel alone.

SPEAKER_00 9:54

Yeah, be in the swirl. That's something to remember. Yeah. Do you do you remember having any situations that you look back on, you know, maybe somebody you don't even have to name them if you want to, but just having an example in your life that just really walked through you, through it with you in the swirl.

SPEAKER_01 10:14

Yeah. Oh, yes. I have a I have several that just I I think the people that were in pain with me, they loved him too, but then didn't make it about their pain. That, you know, that we're there without demanding of time, but actually were there for us, you know. I think I think the most painful thing people can do is try to explain God in that moment. Right. And there's there's no explanation, and it's okay. It's okay. God, God doesn't need our PR. Um, he He He it He's good no matter what's going on. And I learned that. But the you know, we would have people that would say things like, Why did he go to that store? And I'm like, Oh, I don't need to hear that right now, right? That the whys and the what ifs in the middle of that, you don't need to hear any of those kind of questions. It's okay for them to question them, but not with the family, right? Don't and it was hard. Of course, they would want to come to me. I'm their pastor's wife, right? They were looking for answers. I just wasn't in a place that I could give answers at that time.

SPEAKER_00 11:27

Yeah. Now, at that time, like, did you have a pretty tight support network even prior to that? Because I I've heard, I don't know, I've I've talked to pastors' wives before that really have a hard time like connecting with people like in the congregation. So, how was that for you, like in your church?

SPEAKER_01 11:45

I I was very blessed. Uh at an incredible church, and you know, my business was one that had a lot of team members in it. So even them, they were they were so gracious. You know, it's one of the things I say is we even as Christians, even as as strong as we think we are, um, life was not made to be done alone. Um I just encourage people, make efforts to have friends. I'm so thankful for for the community that I had during that time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:16

And consumed by the call was the word. Now, is this this is something that was spoken previous to that sermon that day? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 12:26

Um, interesting enough, he had actually started a Facebook Live event every morning Monday through Friday at 7:30 a.m. And he was bringing series messages, like little devos for people when they were going to work. Periscope was was dying out, and Facebook Live was coming in in 2017. And so he thought, what a great way for me to minister to the community that follows us on socials, and I'll just do a devo every morning. So that devo that week was consumed by the call. So it was like part one, part two, all the way Monday through Friday. And then he finished it up with you know, rounding it out on Sunday morning. So we had actually heard Consumed by the Call of God all week. It was, you

How To Support A Grieving Friend

SPEAKER_01 13:10

know, and you know, which of course is where our business comes from, which is consumed coaching and our family ministry that launched after that called Consumed by the Call Ministries, which me and the kids travel and speak and and really speak on it, came all out of that, all out of that series and that message Sunday morning. So okay.

SPEAKER_00 13:31

So tell us like a little bit about that, you know, launching Consumed by the Call as a Family. Like I would love to hear about that.

SPEAKER_01 13:37

Yeah. So didn't start off as the family. It started off four days after the funeral. Great God woke me up and he it was about 5 30 a.m. and he said, I need you to get on your husband's devo. I need you to go in the studio. And I was like, I don't do that. Like sat on the front pew, he had the doctorates, I don't have the theology degree. I'm arguing with him, and he's like, I need you to get on, I need you to get on. And so I argued with him for a while, but eventually um went into the studio, raw and real, ugly tears and all, just turned the mic on, turned the camera on, and went live. I didn't tell anybody I was even going live, so I figured maybe 50 of my friends would watch, but it was raw. It was just here's where we are, here's what's happened. I know you heard, and here's how God's meeting our family here. And it just really was that, and how God, how God really called me to the to the thy will be done moment. And which, you know, I told him, you know, uh the night of the accident, I told uh I told God, I said, I could get up in that bed and cover my head and be done with this right now, God. You know I could do that and no one would blame me. And he said, Yeah, I I know you could. And he said, But what are you gonna do? And I said, I'm gonna cling to you because I don't know how I'm gonna get through this without you. And I said, So, and tears were just falling into the carpet because I just hit the carpet. And I said, God, if you can take this pain that I didn't even know could feel this deeply painful, if you can take this pain and turn it for your glory, then I'm gonna give it to you. And so now fast forward, I'm on this live and you know, I'm sharing that thy will be done moment. And I don't even know what that's gonna look like, but I'm giving God my yes, messy and all, because I have no idea what's going on. Before midnight that night, 34,000 people saw the video, and they were messaging me from behind because what am I hitting? Why do bad things happen to good people? What does it look like? Where's God when the pain's so real that it feels physical, not just emotional? And you know, when when you're grieving and life and death have just slammed together, that that kind of realness really speaks to the world. And so I was and you know, I was loving on people, leading people to Christ, and then God said, I need you to go live every day. And so right after you were done. Yes, you hit stop and then yeah, and he and so for three and a half years, I went live Monday through Friday. Did you really? I didn't. Raw. I mean, with no training, with no schooling, just just here's where I'm at. You know, we talked, we talked about what it was like to write the first tags on Christmas where I didn't didn't write mom and dad, had to write love mom. The first time my little boy said, Dad will never throw a ball with me. Um where you know, one of the one of the messages early on is where do I put all these tears? Right. And so it was real messages in the midst of what was going

Going Live With Messy Faith

SPEAKER_01 16:55

on. And people were following that because they needed answers too, whether they weren't all necessarily grieving a loved one, but grief comes in many forms, right? So and sometimes honesty is exactly what everybody needs. That's why I love your podcast.

SPEAKER_00 17:11

Oh my gosh. So I'm I'm just imagining like 34,000 people for the first live you did. And could you see you could see that many people watching while you were doing it?

SPEAKER_01 17:25

While I was doing it, it was probably one to two thousand were watching, but it was afterward the replays, and there for the longest time it was running into the you know, into the tens of thousands when during the replay people were were tuning in, yeah. And like a stadium, yes, right. And and then that's what I used to tell people when I would ask them to interview with me, is I said, you and and I still, you know, I talk to clients all the time, and they're like, only you know, like only 200 people watch that, it's only 200 views. I'm like, if you were standing in front of 200 people, right that's an audience, you know. And so, and and you know, of course, the I always think about what the Bible says, the blood of the Lamb and the Word of your testimony are powerful, it changes and transforms lives. And I, you know, I saw it in real time. Like, this is what this looks like, and it was messy, like I didn't know what I was doing, uh, but I was just that part again.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

It's messy, and you didn't know what you were doing. Yes, yes, yes, like somebody needs to hear that today. Yes, let's pause for a moment, yeah, just take it in.

SPEAKER_01 18:34

Yes, yes, because I I think everybody thinks, well, I'll just let someone else do it, but no one can tell your story, no one can tell your experience, and and it needs to be told the way you would tell it, not the way someone else would tell it. And there's a battle going on in this world, there is a battle going on, whether we we keep trying to look away from it or not, there's a battle in this world, and and everybody is vital.

SPEAKER_00 19:01

Everybody, the people I cannot reach someone on this podcast that's listening right now is supposed to exactly because you know, just think of I don't know, I just think of when I talk about the one, you know, I may not know that one. So let's say that one listened to that one first slide you did and went and told, you know, whatever gold keys and you know, nuggets that this person took away, they told one more person about whatever you shared, and then that person shares like it it's that exponential factor of sharing when we're called to do something, like we just don't know.

SPEAKER_01 19:42

We have no effect, we don't know the ripple effect, you know, that happens every you know, you throw a rock and we have no idea the the effect and that ripple effect, and yeah, and what what I pray that I find out one day, because I'll I'm not no here in full effect, but I pray one day when I hit heaven that I hear, you know, that so many people not only gained hope but gained courage. Yes to hear their story, right?

SPEAKER_00 20:10

So did you I mean, have you heard of anybody who did hear your you know three and a half years? Tell us maybe a few testimonies or one testimony that was just such a confirmation to you to keep going. Because I think, you know, one of my favorite phrases is keep going. I think a lot of times, like your, you know, person that you were talking about is like, oh, there's only 200. But what helped you keep going? And and maybe what was the testimonial that you received along the way to help you keep going?

SPEAKER_01 20:38

I I think it's amazing. I, you know, there are many people who've now written their testimony into books, they've they've started podcasts, many of them have started coaching businesses, mentoring businesses, minute, stepped into ministry, done brave things, and and now I see a lot. Well, let me tell you this one thing that's so powerful. Much of that community, because it being Facebook Live, they got to know each other. So I would always start off with good morning, good morning, good morning, because it was early in the morning. And I go, Where's all my pajama girls? Some of you are still in your pajamas. You go on, fess it up, right? So those pajama girls are still connected on Facebook, and I see them talk and they've never met each other in person. Oh my gosh. They met on on my live, and I still see it. I've seen them pray for each other. I've seen, you know, so you you see this interaction, you know, they met in the chat of that live. And then the girls that were going to work, like I'm getting ready, jumping in the car, you know, all of that stuff. We we learned, we lived early morning life with each other and um struggled together. Now, many of them now, because it's been nine years now, some of them are losing spouses. And you know, will write me and say, 'I'm so thankful that I walked through that with you because now I know how to face this. And you know, I'm able to pray with them and and you. Encourage them.

SPEAKER_00 22:01

So three and a half years. What was the moment that called you to just you know lay

Coaching As Kingdom Discipleship

SPEAKER_00 22:10

it down?

SPEAKER_01 22:10

Yeah, it was the weirdest moment. The Lord began to call me into the corporate realm. And I was like, that's really weird, Lord. Like we're we're being effective here, and this is very comfortable. And a company out of Nashville reached out because of my sales background and the fact that in well, let me back up a little bit. We were seeing a grief counselor. He told me to become a coach because he he understood the partnership that happens between a counselor and a coach. So a counselor delves into the background, right? Getting someone from a negative 10 to a zero. A coach takes them from a zero to a 10. And he said, I need someone to pick them up as I finish with them to move them forward. And so it was the first time I had ever heard of life coaching and what coaching was. And so um became a life coach and then eventually went into the John Maxwell, you know, coaching and leadership coaching, and then have since gotten lots of certifications. But so I was doing that and you know, letting that funnel into ministry, knowing that it was radically transforming ministry for me, recognizing that having the skill of coaching um creates creates real transformation, permanent transformation. I can pray for people, I can ask for miracles, I can tell them scriptures, but there's something in that coaching skill set that helps people. And it's what Jesus did, right? Jesus walked up to people and said, What would you have me to do for you? Well, you know, what was he doing? He's he said, self-assess. I didn't Jesus knew what they wanted, right? He he knew all things, so he's asking a question so someone could self-assess. Adam fails, Adam and Eve fail. God walks up and goes, Adam, where are you? God knew where he was to self-assess, right? So God coaching's no new thing. God and Jesus has been doing that. So anyway, so I I got introduced to coaching. Then this corporate company knew my sales background. I grew a multi network marketing business very large, um, ended up in the top one percent of my company. So I have this sales background and this coaching background. This company, someone told them about me and they ended up headhunting me. And and I'm thinking, God, this is not me. Like, I'm not a corporate girly, like this is this is not me. But he kept opening doors, and I've always learned don't knock doors down, but if they open, God's doing something right. So I go through five interviews trying to talk them out of it, like I'm ministry background, I'm not corporate background. End up getting hired, and in that process, realizing God's shifting something, didn't know what it was about. Uh taught sales team and Fortune 500 leaders. In the first month, I'm like coaching 13 different industries, industries I've never been in. But coaching isn't about knowledge, coaching is about questions and leading, right? So I saw the purity of coaching, like what it could look like, watching their incomes triple and quadruple, watching families restored, watching salvations, even right, because I'm very upfront with who I am. About did that for a few years and then found myself in this place going, God, I don't want to do this anymore. Like, I don't care about growing people's income. That's not that's not my goal in life. And and I was like, and he said, What do you want? And I said, I'm gonna be back in I'm gonna be back doing kingdom impact stuff. Um, and it's when he called me to start my own company, Consumed Coaching, March of 2021.

SPEAKER_00 25:49

So consumed coaching. I I can imagine where that name came from.

SPEAKER_01 25:53

Yeah, yes, everything stays right around there. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:58

So and that was back in 2021.

SPEAKER_01 26:00

2021.

SPEAKER_00 26:01

Okay. What did that look like for you to get started? Was there any resistance? Was it? I mean, I feel like when we're called into things, the typical response is you sure got right.

SPEAKER_01 26:17

Imposter syndrome like crazy. Yeah, um, you know, even though you accomplish these things, you know you, right? I know me, I know the self-talk, I know the stuff that's going on inside. Like, and so imposter syndrome, that feeling that you know, I don't know how to do this. And he said, That's exactly who I call because you stay out of my way, so I can build this my way.

SPEAKER_00 26:38

Um, that's another thing. Like, if we think about it just a little bit ago, you just said, you know, kind of like that same phrase, I don't know what I'm doing, kind of right.

SPEAKER_02 26:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:46

So I'm gonna highlight that again. We're we're gonna pause again.

SPEAKER_02 26:50

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

And we're gonna keep this going and be be reminded of that in a moment when you hear more about Francine and how she started her business.

SPEAKER_01 26:59

Yes, yes, absolutely. It's actually the best place to be in when when God's calling you. Like when we think we know what we're doing, that's actually when we get in the way. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:11

And wouldn't you say, well, we'll just stay here for a second. You know, school. You go to school, everything's ducks in a row, everything's gotta be ducks in a row. This is the plan, this is the mathematical equations, the science. Everything's just very formulated. Yes, that's kind of our world. But then you've got kingdom.

SPEAKER_01 27:34

Yeah, formulating graded down. Yes, formulated and graded, like you have to believe whether or not you're ready or not ready, right?

SPEAKER_00 27:43

Right, right. And you can't really think outside of the box because there's only one answer.

SPEAKER_01 27:49

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 27:50

What do you think about that?

SPEAKER_01 27:51

Yeah, it doesn't work in the kingdom.

SPEAKER_00 27:54

Yeah, did you have to kind of unlearn throughout your life at all? Or more so maybe lately since starting this business, or no?

SPEAKER_01 28:03

Absolutely. I I think I totally had to unlearn it. I had to to learn that it's really whether or not God wants to do it. Like I've been in situations, just like I've been in situations where I'm totally unqualified to do something and here God is setting me up and I'm finding success in it. I've also found where I'm totally qualified, should be able to do it, and finding no success in it. I mean, you know, when you when you live a life consumed by the call, when you live the life saying, I lay down my life daily, Lord, then then you will find yourself in those places being directed by God, by by him showing you you can't do this on your own, what I've called you to do, you know, and we try to keep laying back into our own comfort levels of where I feel qualified, where I feel, and you know, I I have a client right now. She was a she was an accountant for 50 years, and God called her to be a writer, podcaster, and coach. And she's like, This has nothing to do with all of my degrees and my experience. Yeah, that's God.

SPEAKER_00 29:09

100%. Yeah, you guys catch that. Okay, so 2021 comes around. You're you're called you're called to start consumed coaching. Yes. What did that look like for you

Building A Bible Based Coach Certification

SPEAKER_00 29:20

to get started?

SPEAKER_01 29:21

Messy again.

SPEAKER_00 29:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:22

Completely messy. I don't do anything alone. So I gathered a bunch of people that I thought were just incredible and and are. Many of them were coaches, some of them were not, but had the qualifications and really had the experience and and the deep knowledge. I knew their leadership level. And so I started looking for looking for certifications that they could do, wasn't feeling good about it, and started just training them on our staff call. And so we thought we'll all join together, we all have different niches. That was kind of messy, and we'll just share business, but we'll be one team under consumed coaching. And in that process, it's kind of like a collective almost where people can kind of choose from maybe Susie who does this, Francine who does this more so male, female, different experiences, different ages, you know, that kind of and so during staff meeting every week, I would do a portion of what I knew a coach needed to have because there were several that really needed to be trained. And then I have these others with high-end, very expensive training on the call, too. Well, I took them through the training and I kept hearing from these people who had, you know, much higher level, even than I had in coaching, going, that's never been explained to me that way. Well, when that starts to happen, you have to take note. That's not me, that's God. And I started to just kind of take a pause and go, God, what are you doing? And he said, He said, You're going to develop a certification program that's Bible-based and kingdom-based. And literally within a couple of days, it was in a workbook, like very different than me. Like this is not something I could do. And I was, I was finishing the workbook, and a friend who I hadn't heard from in years calls me and said, Do you certify coaches? And I'm like, Yes, we do.

SPEAKER_00 31:26

As of today, I do.

SPEAKER_01 31:29

Yes, I do. And we took her through the first certification. She's now blowing and going. She helps online boutique owners uh build to multi-millions and through her experience in coaching. And and I just, and we've been doing that for the last five years.

SPEAKER_02 31:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:49

Last five years, certifying coaches. It's all kingdom-based, biblically based. We we don't use, you know, the languages around new age or anything like that. But we are neuro based. Um, we do talk about how God created the brain. We we do there's portions of it that you know, so mental reps the whole thing, but how God created it. And yeah, it's been incredible to feel like I get to be the match that lights everything. The igniter.

SPEAKER_00 32:19

Yeah, yeah. I love that. Um so tell us uh your first iteration workbook. Has that evolved? Are you still actively using it actively?

SPEAKER_01 32:31

Um the the base of coaching itself. So, like the first probably third of it is the coaching mechanism itself, how it works, how questions, the right question at the right time, all of that kind of thing, the different types of questions, the transforming questions, the implementation questions, you know, the expansion questions, what coaching is, what coaching is not, how do you know when you need a counselor? Those that's like the front half. Then you have the second half, which is actually the mechanics, the things that I found myself actually doing every time I was with a client, right? So those mechanics are taught the freedom ministry and how to break habits, how to transform all of that, uh, mental reps, creating habits, getting rid of habits, that kind of thing is in the center. And then the last part is business, right? Because I have a sales background and marketing background and branding background. So we dabble in that and understanding what a niche is, what a call to action is, what's the difference between track traffic leads and um conversion, all of that kind of thing, because you can be a really great coach. And if you don't have the business end, you know, you're a coach with no clients and no kingdom impact. So we we hit on that. And so that part has developed as I realize there's more need over time.

SPEAKER_00 33:51

Yeah. Wow. So is this like an ongoing training process, or do you have like different times of the year that you bring people in to do coaching training?

SPEAKER_01 34:02

Yeah, for the longest time it was a one-to-one program. We on purpose did that. I think it makes for a very strong program when you do it one-to-one because you really get writing. Yeah. So uh well, first five years, the majority of it was one-to-one. We went to small group, which was three to one, and we're launching our first class, which will have 10 in it actually this year. It I think eventually it will become a an actual open semester and closed semester, as because at the same time we're kind of launching back into our ministry as well as a family. So, but and that'll be more controlled and easier, but we still feel like the best, the best discipleship is done through coaching. And um, yeah, I I won't ever stop creating kingdom coaches because I believe that that answers the discipleship problem in the church.

SPEAKER_00 34:55

Yeah, it's that it's that ripple effect too in massive ways. Yeah, when is your next class gonna be done?

SPEAKER_01 35:02

July 15th and 16th. There's one in the in the afternoon and one in the evening.

SPEAKER_00 35:08

Okay, okay. What was my other question? Oh, I do have a question because we have questions. The Lord calls me a woman of wonder. So as a coach, and I've I think if you could even just share like your best encapsulated way to explain to somebody what a coach is. I think sometimes people don't fully understand what a coach is. I think there's a lot of just even in our world right now, there's a lot of coaches that are more so operating as consultants, would you say?

SPEAKER_02 35:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:44

So could you kind of take us down that path a little bit to help people maybe understand what we do a little bit?

SPEAKER_01 35:52

Yes. So a a coach understands that we don't have all the all the answers, right? And we're humble enough to know what we're doing. Yes, yes. But um, but the answers are inside of the client that we're sitting in front of. They just don't know how to find them. And through understanding what a question actually does, then we're able to help them unpack that, begin to self-assess. We also hold accountability. So um when I look at at coaching, it is, you know, it's it's accountability, it's helping them create new habits, it's consistency, it's bringing awareness, all of those pieces come into play. And the fact that you meet with your coach either asynchronously, asynchronously or synchronously, there's accountability, that's an automatic accountability. I I used to laugh. I used to meet with my clients every two weeks in the business realm. And I always said, when did you actually get your to-do list done, your your activities done? Two days ago, yesterday, right? That's accountability. If they weren't meeting with me, it never would have gotten done. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:08

And then it's a huge part, right? The accountability piece I've found, you know, I need a coach. I'm a coach. I need a coach. Do you have a coach?

SPEAKER_01 37:16

I have a coach. Or coaches to me, it's the first thing I I tell my clients, I said if you're gonna hire an hire a coach, first thing you need to ask them is who's their coach. Because if they don't have a coach, they don't believe in coaching. They just want to be a coach.

SPEAKER_02 37:32

100%. 100%.

SPEAKER_00 37:34

So, how would you explain to somebody, you know, maybe that difference of a consultant then with a coach? And even kind of, we did talk a little bit about counselor, kind of that, you know, negative 10 to zero, kind of even that difference there with the counselor coach as well.

SPEAKER_01 37:50

Yeah, good point. So a and a mentor and account and a consultant come come with experience. They if I'm looking for a mentor, whether a mentor being more like a mentor mom, I'm looking for a mom who's done it successfully, right? If I'm looking for a consultant for like my ministry, I need to find someone who knows how they have experience and a track record to to bring that into play. Now I'm a little different than most coaching programs, and I believe that there are there are spaces I I let my my clients know when I'm putting on a new hat. There are times I'm putting on a consultant hat. There are times when I'm putting a mentor hat on because I have the credibility and the the experience to be able to put on that. Now I don't put it on if it's not one I'm, you know, I I can't say I'm a consultant in something I've never experienced. I can coach through that, but I can't, I can't consult that. And it is a much higher pay grade consult. I mean, it just is. You're you're coming with experience and knowledge and probably plans and yeah, and you're usually on site a lot of times, like what I'm doing with YWAM, and the fact that I'm I'm coming here, meeting with the team, I'm unpacking it all, and I'm creating a plan. And part of that part of creating that plan is, you know, a master document, and then I meet with the team and I set them out. That's consulting. That's not true.

SPEAKER_00 39:16

Yeah, and I imagine you kind of bring some coaching into it too, because absolutely. I imagine you're multi-passionate as well. I think a lot of coaches are as well, right?

SPEAKER_01 39:27

Yes. So when I'm unpacking the plan and I'm creating the plan and I'm seeing what's broken and what's not broken and what's what needs to be more highlighted or what have you, that's the consultant side. But when I get done with the consultant side, now it's the people. How are they executing? What are they struggling with? What is the limiting mindset? Where's the scarcity mindset here? Do they have the right habits in place? Are they, you know, all of the things now to execute the plan? That's when the coach comes in play.

SPEAKER_00 39:57

Such it's such a blessing. Yeah. I'm sure, right? It's such like looking back, so over even over these last five years,

Restore The Altar And The Road Ahead

SPEAKER_00 40:05

let's go here for a second. Maybe share a testimonial, maybe of one of the students that have come through, somebody who, like you've just seen, have just amazing leaps and bounds in who they were here. You know, you talk about zero to ten. So that coach doing that zero to ten. Would you share? You know, if I know we're we're very confidential as coaches, so you don't have to share names if you don't want to, but would you mind sharing just something with us?

SPEAKER_01 40:35

Yeah. You know, it's really interesting because I don't have a uh a lot of coaching programs out there have a certain niche that they teach, right? Whether it be leadership or or you know, a certain family fitness, what have you. A lot of our coaches, when we get near the end, we're we're seeing a lot of things like personality, spiritual giftings, um, experience and all of that. So we have coaches that are in the fitness realm, we have coaches, nutritional realm, we have them that are life coaches, business coaches, um, and even some of them that have taken it now into the corporate world where they're coaches in a corp in a in a business, right? And they've been hired into the corporate realm, or someone I we we have it, it's I guess this would be one of the stories. I have this beautiful woman of God who ran large teams in mega churches, one of the smartest women that I know. And I was telling her, you really need to be a coach. She was transitioning out of that, and she was like, I, you know, I don't know anything about that. And and just watching her develop into and then eventually hired by a large counseling company because having a few coaches on their staff brings a whole different element to it, and on top of that, they're not state bound, right? Counselors are licensed in per state, whereas a coach is not, and so that opened the ability for so she's now in in that setting. So our our coaches, these coaches can be in all sorts of settings, like this skill set can be used in ministry, in business, what have you.

SPEAKER_00 42:19

So there's so many places we can go. Oh, the places we'll go like Dr. Seuss.

SPEAKER_01 42:24

And it brings such life, right? Um you know, I tell people you you want the best, even more so than having a gym or fitness center in your business. Have a life coach in your business. I said, that marriage that's falling apart at home is affecting their job. You know, the the fact that their kids are no longer connected to them is affecting their job. And I said, I understand that you want to give them vitamins in a fitness center so that they're not sick, but they can be sick in so many different areas. And having a couple of life coaches and a large company and offering that, you know, people will not leave. They will not leave because they know the power.

SPEAKER_00 43:05

Have you have you seen that happening a lot more with companies really kind of taking that on? Or is it still kind of a new concept?

SPEAKER_01 43:13

Would you say not enough? I've I've seen it a couple of times, and but a lot of times they try to they try to facilitate a compassionate person in their in in their company and use them that way. And and I'm like, you need to get them trained, like they they need to know how to do that because compassion really can mess you up. Not actually coaches say we're compassionate, we're your biggest fan, we partner with you, we want your goals, but we also tell you hard things, right?

SPEAKER_00 43:45

Yeah, absolutely. I've been called an eagle mama, so I like to kick them out of the nest. Yes, absolutely. You guys know how an eagle works with the little babies. We are, you know, they're very compassionate and everything's comfy and you can get comfortable here. Little babies, and then all of a sudden the parents start putting sticks in there to get them uncomfortable, and then they kick them out. So I feel like there's that again, compassion and kick you out. Yes, absolutely. Yes. The best. I think it's amazing. So I have to ask, and I don't think I've asked you this before, but have you written a book? I have beyond the workbook.

SPEAKER_01 44:24

Yeah. Interesting enough, we I did over a hundred podcasts, and the Lord said, I need you to take all those podcasts and each of them find the ones that I want and create a book out of each podcast. I mean a chapter out of each podcast. And it created a book called Calling Over Comfort.

SPEAKER_00 44:44

Really? So okay, so the you're you had a podcast or you and outside of the Facebook lives that you were doing as well? Yes. Okay, and what's the name of the podcast?

SPEAKER_01 44:53

Calling Over Comfort.

SPEAKER_00 44:54

Calling Over Comfort. Okay. And are you still doing that?

SPEAKER_01 44:57

No. It's still out there, but no.

SPEAKER_00 44:59

So people can still go listen?

SPEAKER_01 45:02

They can.

SPEAKER_00 45:02

Oh. And when did your book come out?

SPEAKER_01 45:05

Two years ago. So I about a year and a half ago. And I I just took the podcast and facilitated, you know, changed it around where it was more of a chapter, but they're they're named after each chapter and then broken down into different segments of uh content. So but they're all the podcast really. Amazing. And do you love writing? I do.

SPEAKER_00 45:30

I do have more book babies to come.

SPEAKER_01 45:33

I think so. Yeah. I have definitely the main story has not really been put into a book. I've sat down several times, but I think I'm gonna need a writer's coach for that one.

SPEAKER_00 45:45

That would be that would be amazing, right? So I think we need to loop back a little bit to ministry with a family.

SPEAKER_01 45:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 45:53

Tell us more about what that's looked like.

SPEAKER_01 45:55

So we've picked that back up. The Lord's really been calling us back out. Now my children are 30, 25, and 20. So, and working alongside me, all love Jesus and leading worship and teaching next to me, powerhouses. Even the 20-year-old son is just powerhouse, drops nuggets like nobody's business, challenges me. And we we have this conference that begins in October. We've been preparing for it called Restore the Altar. Um, it's a two-day conference that we offer to churches, and all four of us speak. The, and then there's a beautiful QA panel that we're gonna do on the second day, and then workshops where we're gonna break out into different tables and facilitate small group discussions during and worship and all of those things. The whole point of restore the altar is we really feel like what's going on in the world isn't really about the world, it's really about the church losing the altar. And when there's no altar and there's no sacrifice, and just like Elijah poured water all over it, we see that as worship. So you rebuild if if you read the scriptures when Elijah was on Mount Carmel with Baal, Baal's altar was there, but then you notice when Elijah goes, the 12 stones were there too. It meant that alt God's altar used to be there, but it was no longer tended. So it had broken down. He rebuilt it with the stones that were there, of course, laid a sacrifice on it, and then poured water on it. For us to do that today, one of the things that we want to do is restore our individual altars, restore the altar of our families, and then restore the altar in the churches.

SPEAKER_02 47:46

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 47:47

So, how do you do that? We rebuild the altar through repentance and humility and recognizing who God is and who we are, and all of those things, recognizing that we're bought and paid with for a price. We're the sacrifice, we're living sacrifices, right? Laid on the altar and then then, you know, just covered in worship, the water, covered in worship. And when you do that, God brings fire. And I don't know how many times I thought, just light me on fire, God. You and that's how He's gonna restore it again. And that's what we're bringing to these conferences. Starts in October. We want to take it all over the nation. We're in the process now of booking that. And then God told me this last month, he said, You're going global after that. And my daughter was in Mongolia at the time, and the pastors all said, We want you to come here, and so we're we already know we're going to Mongolia. We have some connections to the Philippines and a couple of other places, so and it's interesting. I'm with YWAM right now, which they're global, so interesting, isn't God interesting?

SPEAKER_00 48:57

Just have that little revelation, yes, isn't that fun? Yeah, and that's part of coaching too, is talking it out, literally, verbalizing something, and then you're like, oh yeah, right? Yeah, it's seriously amazing. So have you had this conference before?

SPEAKER_01 49:13

It's first time, first time in October. Okay, so again, you're doing something for the first time. Yes, yes. Now, the Lord did give me a workbook, and I'm in process of teaching a seven-piece Bible study, and I'm teaching it live and recording it with the workbook right now. So the message is being like needed. Um in like Pottery.

SPEAKER_00 49:40

And the message is needed.

SPEAKER_01 49:42

Yes, yes, yes. So, and so we're meeting once a week on Thursday nights. So I'm out of town this week, but um we've already met three weeks. It's been incredible. Like, yeah, the Bible study itself, interesting enough, I teach in the front end, but then there's a confrontation question, which God told me, he said confrontation. I was like, I don't like that word. And he was like, No, it's a confrontation question. And the question he gave me is very confronting to us, like we it's a search your heart kind of question, and then there's an activation they actually do before they come back the next day, and like the first one says, you know, kneel and say, you know, and do this, and then up under it, I wrote, you know, your body tells your spirit, like it speaks to your spirit, and so don't skip the kneeling, right? So really powerful. So, and we're already seeing these uh like transformation that you can't do through just information, right?

SPEAKER_00 50:46

There it is. Yeah, so these conferences that you're gonna be doing starting in October, will they be live streamed or are they all gonna be like they're gonna be live?

SPEAKER_01 50:57

Uh no, they'll be live, like in churches, like the two that we booked last December, which we thought were just individual. We had no idea at that point that it was actually gonna turn into more of a tour, but they're in Alaska. Like God said, it's literally He said, start in Alaska, and we have two churches, one in Valdez and one in Fairbanks, that have that booked us last December to come and do a conference. So, and it's in them asking us to come that I did the research and really spending time with God. And this is how He works. Like I gave a yes to something I didn't even have, right? And then, you know, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:38

I feel like it's have you had these moments where you give your yes and then it's almost like this outpouring overflow, and you're like, I can't keep up with all of the ideas. Yes, yes. And so how do you organize all of that? I mean, how do you how do you I mean, because I'm like that and I have people I know, clients, like we just get a lot. We get a lot of downloads,

Timing God’s Ideas And Final Encouragement

SPEAKER_00 52:00

we get a lot of you know, you might have the blueprint, maybe there's puzzle pieces all over the place. How do you how do you sort through it and you know step into that next thing then?

SPEAKER_01 52:10

So I I like I said, I am a writer, so I do like to handwrite things. I had a counselor, the can the grief counselor we worked with, he made a statement one time. He said, I I have to steward the ideas and thoughts God's given me. And I've never thought about that being stewarded, that that no different than my money, no different than my talents, right? The thoughts and ideas. And so this is messy, but I write them all down. I there's a bag on my desk that I keep them in until it's kind of full, and then I at some point I sit and I put them in the right spaces. Like, this is branding, this is coaching, this is ministry, and and it I have books that hold these ideas. Some of them won't be used for three years down the line. All of a sudden, I'm like, I have a podcast I'm gonna do, or I have a lesson that I'm gonna do. So, like right now, God released three, three books, Restore the Altar, Forged. What what do you do when the fire comes? And then out of the wilderness, there is an exit to every wilderness. So I have no idea what forged and out of the wilderness is, but I have the book cover. Yeah. And so I know when I finish Restore the Altar, God's gonna give me forged and He's gonna give me, and you just trust him. He's gonna be there when it's time.

SPEAKER_00 53:38

Yeah. And how do you like how do you determine the timing then? Because I feel like a lot of people, and just in our world, everything's so fast paced that I think sometimes, you know, think of pregnancy, right? When you're pregnant, it's like the end of your pregnancy, okay. I'm I'm I'm done. Like there's a point of like, we're a little overdue here, but sometimes I think a lot of times people want to rush that pregnancy.

SPEAKER_02 54:02

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 54:02

And then, you know, it is messy. Pregnancy, birthing, all of it's messy, it's uncomfortable, it's painful. But how do you determine the timing in this fast-paced world that is trying to tell you that you have to do everything now?

SPEAKER_01 54:17

Yeah, yeah. Goodness. I'm I tend to be the one that goes too fast. So God actually has to slow me down sometimes because I'm wanting to execute and execute now. But number one, I have to have peace. Um, I'm not gonna do it on my own will or my own knowledge. I've done that enough where I've gone and executed something, it wasn't what God wanted. It it did not affect the world the way it was supposed to affect the world. And it was a lot of waste of time. And I think sometimes I have to remind myself you don't have time to waste your time. And the people, the people that follow you don't want to waste their time on only what you can bring to them without it being God led. So um, I have to keep that in my mind because you know, I can take God's idea and run with it instead of you know, kneel and ask him, so what do you want to do with your idea? So yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 55:18

Have you ever just kind of started your day just saying, Hey, Lord, what are we doing today?

SPEAKER_01 55:25

Not enough, but yes, I have experienced that and and I and I do that periodically, but not enough. You know, a lot of times we as humans wake up and go, God, this is my calendar, bless it. Right? Like, hey, that wasn't any of my ideas.

SPEAKER_00 55:42

So yeah, it's fun because there'll be a lot of like detours, random conversations, you know, just having that open space to, you know, do whatever it is that he's calling us to do for the day. So this has been amazing. I was gonna ask you like what the Lord's stretching you into, but I think you're kind of in a very stretching season already right now. Like it, but is there anything else that you feel you're being stretched into? Like just even if you look over these last, you know, nine years, who are you now? Who were you then? Like, how have you grown? Maybe.

SPEAKER_01 56:25

You know, I spent so many years uh producing a product, learning how to present that product, learning how to market that product, getting paid to deliver that product. Um, but going back to ministry, that's not the way it works. You know, it is it is uh, you know, based in giving. It's not based in an invoice. That's very odd for me. And weirdly as it sounds, difficult when you're, you know, when you're a widow and you don't have your husband's income there and you know, and then you don't I don't I don't even know how to explain it. I mean, we're supported by givers, we're supported by um churches who believe in what we do. And I'm not used to asking for that. I'm used to asking for here's what I can deliver and this is what it cost. Like a tangible, yes, yes, which is weird because I went from ministry into doing that, which at that transition it was weird. Now I'm being pulled back into that transition and I'm like, oh, this is quite wild, right? And do you find that it's kind of melded even? It is because now we're still doing kingdom coach certification. That is a product and a program, and and there's an invoice with it, and then you know, but then again, I go to a church, fly to Alaska, we take care of all of our all of our own expenses to take up a love offering and trust God on it, right?

SPEAKER_00 58:00

So good. Yeah, you are a gem. I just love you. Oh my gosh. Um, so as you know, this is for the one. So if you were just gonna imagine that one who's listening in right now, do you have any other words of encouragement or wisdom that you'd want to share over that one today? Trust him. He's good.

SPEAKER_01 58:20

He already, he's already way ahead of you. Um, he's waiting on you. And there are people waiting on your story, and they're waiting on you to give God your messes because you are the one to reach them. So trust him, he's got you. He's got you.

SPEAKER_00 58:37

Oh, thank you. Well, I'm gonna close with hope and locked anchoring verse, which is may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace and believing so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope. That's Romans 15, 13. What is the best way for people to get in touch with you?

SPEAKER_01 58:54

Yes. Well, if you are feeling cold and you heard something in this coaching thing that you you're probably most likely you're sitting there going, well, I've been doing that my whole life. Of course you have, of course you have, because there's a spiritual gifting behind it. So if you've been doing that your whole life and you want to feel more confident in it and know know the pathways in it, we would love to have a conversation with you. If we're a good fit, we would love to help you get certified and walk out that calling. And you can go to www.kingdomcoach certification.com and schedule a free call. Amazing.

SPEAKER_00 59:34

Thank you. I'll have that in the show notes too if you didn't catch it. If you're out running or driving, we don't want you riding while you're driving. So head to the show notes, reach out to Francine when you get a chance, and I'll be back with another episode next week. Thank you for being a brave voice who's setting so many free. I'll be back next week. Bye.